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Reimbursable expenses/Pay-as-you-go

(8 posts)

  1. Elisa
    Member

    I figured that some of the questions that were coming up had to do with what is eligible for reimbursement and how that might affect the pay-as-you-go part of the plan.

    ~ I looked and looked and it seems as if TIF funds can be used for structural renovations and other property improvements, along with the facade improvements ~ even if it's in a conservation district. Warrenville even bought bleachers, goalposts and a computer with TIF funds! http://www.warrenville.il.us/b_bus-dev_tif-info.aspx

    ~ If the Village is going to go through with a TIF then it really wouldn't "matter" how much money was paid to Kane McKenna because those are eligible expenses and could be reimbursed.

    ~ I have questions about the pay-as-you-go approach. If the Village ever wants to consider eminent domain - or even an agreeable sale if the buyer is motivated - then they couldn't pay-as-they-go. There would be no funds there to aquire a private home or two - let alone try to buy a larger piece of property. I would appreciate the Board discussing this aspect in public - because I don't know how they could possibly do some of the things they propose to do if it's simply pay-as-you-go.

    Posted Tuesday Mar 6, 2007 17:52 #

  2. Lonnie
    Member

    That's right Elisa. There are ways for them to get around this, such as a "loan" from the general fund. Then what if the TIF doesn't work out? Guess who's on the hook for the money? I think "pay as you go" is a sham.

    Posted Tuesday Mar 6, 2007 18:13 #

  3. spatny
    Member

    It simply stands to reason that if this TIF was in place it would make no money available for at least two years, and then only a very small amount. No one with any sense would invest money in redevelopment or facade renovation and be the pioneer and then have to wait years for the Village to come up with an increment of their own increased taxes. This would have to be a two-step - first you get the TIF in place and then you borrow - from the General Fund or somewhere else to get something going. There is already a two-tier quasi-commitment form the Village to the Arcade developers that would take a good chunk of what would be generated in the first three years (or more). This whole plan is bogus.

    Posted Tuesday Mar 6, 2007 21:44 #

  4. Catherine
    Member

    "I have questions about the pay-as-you-go approach. If the Village ever wants to consider eminent domain - or even an agreeable sale if the buyer is motivated - then they couldn't pay-as-they-go. There would be no funds there to aquire a private home or two - let alone try to buy a larger piece of property. I would appreciate the Board discussing this aspect in public - because I don't know how they could possibly do some of the things they propose to do if it's simply pay-as-you-go."

    Thank you for this astute observation, Elisa. I recall one Board meeting that was concluded for private session to discuss a real estate acquisition, so there must be money somewhere. When you pay fire sale prices (called fair market value) for homes, perhaps where the money will come from is less mysterious.

    Posted Wednesday Mar 7, 2007 04:42 #

  5. MikeT
    Member

    Elisa said--
    ~ If the Village is going to go through with a TIF then it really wouldn't "matter" how much money was paid to Kane McKenna because those are eligible expenses and could be reimbursed.

    This alone should put the warning lights on people when assessing this TIF. Now I am learning that the fees Kane Mckenna would charge to administer the TIF would be reimbursable. That is a great deal for them: they are able to clear the way for a structure that would siphon a steady stream of funds, a portion of which could be used by their own firm. We're all grown up here. Doesn't that seem to dubious?

    "After surveying the field of alternatives available for the Village of Riverside to achieve its goals, we, the firm of Kane McKenna Inc, choose... TIF".

    .
    .
    The other questions about pay as you go and the mechanics of the TIF also noted in this thread and in about 3,000 other posts on this forum, continue to point to a lack of clarity on the 'how' the TIF operates, as well as of the goals of the TIF.

    IF IS THE MIDDLE WORD IN TIF

    is pithy and reductionist, but true. I talked w/ a fellow TIF district owner (of a house), and it was his belief that the Village would not have enough money to acquire his home for at least 10 years. I ran this by the Village Manager, and she did not dispute this belief. But she also made a big caveat about - 'you never know', it depends on how the TIF goes. See my saying.

    But, curiously, when we DO see with clarity a mechanical aspect of the TIF - as what was stated in the first part of this post - and when we DO see what is a goal of the TIF (coercive acquisition of private property for a multistory parking deck, for example), we do not like this aspect of the TIF.

    So TIF is darned if it doesn't and darned if it does.

    Posted Wednesday Mar 7, 2007 10:46 #

  6. spatny
    Member

    Consultant firms ride the rails up and down the Metra system doing these TOD studies and then coming forth with the "answer" to how to get all the little projects in the wish lists they develop. Do a TIF, and of course we will manage it for you (for a fee) that will come from the increment, and there you go. A cottage industry right along the rails, and every time you do one you have another feather in your cap to sell the next bunch of yokels down the road - oops, railroad, I mean. First you only pay part for the TOD study, which of course recommends more density and a parking structure and downtown destination shops and restaurants along the right-of-way. Then, after you drool over the "Boutique Hotels" and "Riverside Restaurants" and "Community Centers" and all the other hot shot ideas they foist on you, why of course you need some way to finance it - and also increase your own coffers and create high buck condos for "empty-nesters" that can sell their homes to families with kids. For the towns and trustees that get hit with this pitch it's like Adam taking to the serpent and looking at Eve. "But I always loved apples." Sure you did.

    Posted Wednesday Mar 7, 2007 12:03 #

  7. MikeT
    Member

    I know free association / metaphor is grating to some, but in spatny's description above of the consultant firms, I'm channeling Harold Hill in The Music Man, riding the rails going across the midwest trying to sell the towns that they need a band ...and band instruments and band uniforms.

    Oh, we got trouble
    Right here in River City

    THAT'S TROUBLE WITH A CAPTIAL T, and IT SPELLS TIF...+

    CHORUS: ....TIF TIF TIF

    .

    http://www.niehs.nih.gov/kids/lyrics/trouble.htm

    +with apologies to Meredith Wilson

    Posted Wednesday Mar 7, 2007 15:23 #

  8. spatny
    Member

    Mike - well it is kinda like the Circus came to town. I hope we don't end up having to follow the elephants.

    Posted Wednesday Mar 7, 2007 16:18 #

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